ABIGOR – THERE’S NO LIFE

Published: 2008.07.03

A new, amazing album is on its way to your head. I promise you, this is something very original and special, and will definitely raise some stir in the extreme metal scene. TT answered questions with dedication and spirit!

Have you done many interviews so far?
“PK has been presenting Abigor in public for the last years and he’s doing a lot, while so far I did Imhotep - I appreciate Roy´s support very much, German Legacy, French Metallian and now Scream. With some more confirmed to follow soon, we covered all the important mags which is a major concern of mine, as many “superstar” bands turned their back on the militant views of Black Metal while it should be an extreme artform. I’m on a mission to put that straight again.”

How is the feedback on the new album?
“EAL has just started to carefully spread the promos so the album isn’t in everybody’s MP3 library months before its release, and the reactions have been perfect so far. It’s not a light, easy album that people enjoy at the very first listen, like f.e. a Darkthrone album, so I wondered if reviewers just skip through it, don’t get the point and write a critic that has nothing to do with “Fractal Possession”. I’m grateful that the ones who have it so far at least took the 50 minutes and understood what we do.”

Why are you satisfied with your new album?
“For the first time we had the technique, knowledge and time to realize our musical visions, and this is a whole new starting point. Back in the 90s we had a nearly live approach in the studio, a few takes and done. These days we beat the maximum out of every single note.”

How does this album differ from your previous releases? More industrial and progressive structured perhaps?
“It’s strange, I realized people perceive our sound completely different than we do. To us, “FP” is a guitar album, while everybody focuses on the VERY few samples and synths - only “Apokalypse” and “Orkblut” had less synthetic additions! But I think I know where the impression comes from: it is a precise, surgical, detailed work and therefore has a very inhuman, cold atmosphere. Every single note, each syllable, each drumhit is there for a reason and this is what you can expect from now on - we record in our own studio and won’t start the mixdown before everything isn’t 100% approved to be the best we can. But that’s progression, we never consciously changed anything in our musical concept, this method seems natural to us, now that we sharpened skills.”

Why the big change in style from the “Satanized” album?
“After I quit in 2000 PK did “Satanized”, so my composition part and playing was taken over by him and other musicians, naturally it sounds different then. But the style is still the same in my opinion: Black Metal not the primitive way – to avoid the word “complex”. And our personal development has to be considered as well, we’re not exactly the same people as some years back, we need to push ourselves constantly, and with age and experience you have more control.”

The thing I first thought of when listening to the album was intelligent songwriting. Comment?
“As stated above we take a lot of time these days, for composition and for recording/mixdown. As much as I appreciate your comment I would say that the act of making music is spiritual, while the clever/intelligent part is done in the studio - still we alter and change a lot in there, so the line between songwriting, arranging and execution is blurred. Making music in general is very emotional, you think you “switch off” your head, but the intellect always has a word to say.”

Are there any changes in the line-up?
“Yes, we have a new vocalist fronting Abigor: a highly original voice and an uncompromising soul, AR. In the 90s Silenius had a major influence on how our albums sounded, his voice was unique, and now with AR we have found someone that fits the new incarnation of Abigor perfectly, to say the least.”

How is the composing process in the band?
“We don’t even meet to play guitar anymore, PK and me work on our own, and then exchange CD-Rs - so we can avoid rehearsals to a 100%. This is perfect for us - as profane the technical part of songwriting and recording seems, using a computer etc, it’s still a sacred act, and I prefer to be alone while doing this. If I want to spend an hour just to try out some things I do it without compromise, same goes for PK. A rehearsal room with people drinking, making noise or waiting until one’s got his shit together - thanx, not for us.”

Where is the album recorded, and is there any elements that you really want to record again?
“No regrets and no wishes to change anything, for the first time. We recorded in our own studio: hell-lab@hotmail.com. I did a proper engineering education and built the studio in the past 6 years, together with 2 other people as hi-end gear costs a fortune, but there’s no compromise when it comes to quality.”

Liveplans?
“None. We insist on total freedom while doing our albums with not a single thought wasted on if we could implement something live or not. Furthermore satanic art as we do it doesn’t work live. Need a third reason? While being on tour one could develop and/or write a new album which is what we’re all about, walking the path not looking back.”

Tell me some about the lyric, and tell me which person in the band that writes them?
“We all write lyrics in general, but this time most lyrics came from PK, with a few from AR. As PK and I re-unioned Abigor, he has written a lot over the past years. So this album has no concept but various themes - praising the Lord and challenging the listener in terms of his/her conceptions of good and evil. As every track has a different topic I can just point to the booklet/sleeves, you’ll find excerpts of each lyric there.”

What are your inspirational sources for making music and be musicians?
“It’s a flame that burns inside - you don’t want to make music, you HAVE TO make music, otherwise you fucking burn. Creativity is a gift that doesn’t mean only pleasure, a lot of suffering is part of it as well. Art that bears no pain is not worth anything.”

Today you play music more in the vein of Aborym and Dødheimsgard. Any relationship to those bands?
“”666 International”, also lyric-wise, together with Ved Buens Ende’s “Written In Waters”, is one of the 10 best Metal records of the 90s. I have no relationship to Aborym except that I know Attila has been singing there, and I respect Attila’s performance very much in general.”

What inspires you to make your kind of music?
“We exist through Him, our music is a path to Him. But inspirations come from living - every breath, every minute means inspiration on a subconscious level. I hardly experienced any “flash” of inspiration, like some state they go out in the nightly forest and this inspires them. For sure art and books are inspiring, but it would be too easy to break it down to this or that.”

What do you think of the coverart on the album?
“We’re no teenagers anymore, so it’s obvious that colourful shiny fantasy covers aren’t our case. We wanted to do something that reflects the detailed music, and has a sacred “feel”, nothing that meets the Metal standards. We had our visual concept and Timo Ketola, who did many important artworks in the past years, put his hands on it. Both vinyl and CD are of a very high quality, the doubleLP with proper innersleeves and the CD-book, you’ll see soon…”

If someone without knowledge to your music ask you which type of music you are playing, what would your answer be?
“Uncompromising Black Metal, a form of Satanic Art.”

Are you satisfied with the work the label are doing for you?
“I contacted End All Life/Norma Evangelium Diaboli as an absolute fan, they had a big influence how the "scene" developed in the new millennium because they set standards, scales. And as much as it is an honour to be in the line of their releases as much have I been surprised by their professional work and dedicated support, a comparison maybe: Napalm 2 points, EAL 10. From pre-release support to album realization and promotion, I never heard a single “not possible”, not even a “no” from EAL. If anyone thinks just because they also do black/white vinyl in a 200 limited edition means they’re less professional than any fucking major, think again. Although I used these terms already in this interview: EAL stands for militant and uncompromising work within this movement called Black Metal.”

What is the idea behind the bandname?
“Abigor, the demon of war, there’s no better guard a band could have.”

What do you think of the metalscene of today in general?
“I listen to Black Metal exclusively when it comes to Metal. Don’t get me wrong, since I was an 8 years old child I collected Metal – but that’s not what I would call religious art, which is what I’m interested in. For purely musical delights I explore other territories: classical/Neue Musik, Electronic, old guitar based music from the 80s etc...
Black Metal is an extreme artform and pushes boundaries, and in this regard I am ablaze with enthusiasm, let me just name a few examples who did truly honourable works recently: Deathspell Omega above all, Katharsis, Antaeus, Clandestine Blaze, Blacklodge, Diapsiquir... if this is what one calls “scene”, I am proud to participate.”

What is your relationship to the Norwegian metal scene?
“Black Metal has a history in Norway like nowhere else, but when I think about the last 3 years I can only come up with a few albums/bands that are truly superior. To be honest: I have a big problem with “Black Metal” bands that are just nihilistic. Still, Enslaved never did anything bad, they are brilliant on every album. Arcturus’ recent LP is kind of Fates Warning in their best years for the new millennium. Both bands never played with a satanic image and I appreciate this very much. But many "old heroes" forgot where their creativity originated from: they were kissed by the devil. It may sound strange to you but I mean it exactly as I say it: it is Him they honoured back in the day, it is Him they betrayed, so He took away their talent – obviously. Now they produce uninspired, weak shit. The once “evil” ones that turned to hellish clowns. One thing is certain, their soul will burn, and all this just for a bit of fame and money, hahaha…”

The short, the simple, yet the wide question that I’d like you to answer, is: What is black metal? (The obvious answer is that your band performs black metal, thus you can name only your band. If your band hadn’t played what I and the rest of the metal world would define as black metal, you wouldn’t be questioned at all by me. But, my challenge to you is that you should try to answer the question without naming as much as one single band. )
“Although the box "Black Metal record collection" contains a few 90s Pagan/Viking/Heathen/Nihilistic/whatever albums (just remember what widespread concepts would have been released on Deathlike Silence), the devil must be motivation, cause and matter of a Black Metal band. Now you will comment on sporadic lyrics of ours which had “pagan” topics, like “Orkblut” or “Unleashed Axe-Age” - both written more than 12 years ago. In a true Grishnackh revisionist way I could say we i.e. just highlighted that Fenris and Loki are mythological characters obviously kissed by the devil, hehehe. True is that Abigor have always been a satanic Black Metal band since our very first track “In Sin”- our credo, with lyrical journeys like “Orkblut” outside worshipping the devil, yes.
On a musical side Black Metal has set itself some characteristics in the early days, or better, Quorthon set them and we (Black Metal musicians of the very early 90s) increased speed and added some more elements. But today I just demand 1. distorted guitars and drums for the Metal factor and 2. a dark atmosphere, besides I can only say there´s no limit. Deathspell Omega is the proof and the scale when you leave the obvious Metal harmonies and structures aside, or tones like “In Absentia Christii” that didn’t incorporate any fast drums or typical Black Metal riffs and vocals. In fact I would like to see a balance between traditional Black Metal bands which are always “enjoyable” to listen to and those who break the boundaries. Black Metal must not be music that’s on the “safe” side, nice ear pleasing music. Many people simply confuse a rehearsal sound and standard Black Metal harmonies (think the thousand boring copycat riffs of timeless classics like “Stemmen Fra Tårnet” or “Transilvanian Hunger”) with “evil” music exclusively, but that’s just nostalgia. It may be very harmonic at points though, and we have just as much of such harmonic and familiar Black Metal riffs in our music. But the intention should be to harm the listener, not to please him. As well as the musicians shouldn’t please but challenge themselves – challenge in terms of composition, not stupid guitarhero techniques. Some people just seem to masturbate and their creamy standard Black Metal is the resulting cumshot which gives them easy satisfaction and relaxation. They are nothing but pointless. Once again: simple traditional Black Metal is not what I’m offending here, but half hearted music that bears no pain. Black = satanic, Metal = distorted guitars and drums. That’s it.”

You make what I would name black metal. Forget about the entire index of romantic…, horror…, unholy…, satanic… etc. categories, and let us stick to the two words. Why did you develop your musical taste in the extreme direction, instead of following the mainstream taste of pop and rock, buying releases from artists that sell a lot of albums? And on the same subject, why do you stick to the insanity while growing older, perhaps breeding and creating a family? (There is more than one road to Hell. You can name the traditional bands or you can blame it on your older brother. But the aspect that interests me most is what made you feel the need for making music instead of being a listener only.)
“A very personal question that asks why I’m the person that I am... Let’s focus on the musical aspect first. I guess in general music is in my genes, my father and my grandfather are musicians. As soon as I could sit and walk I played with (or better, destroyed) my father’s Pink Floyd, Led Zeppelin, Deep Purple etc records. My fave game as a 3 years old child has been searching for the label logo on an LP cover and on the vinyl and match them, build a drumkit out of cookware, or use sticks and bricks of wood to pretend I play guitar in kindergarten – simply everything connected to Rock music. On my 8th birthday I could choose something from a big shopping centre (Vienna SCS, I still have the image of the sales desk with that 7" box in my mind), and I picked out the singles “Run To The Hills” and “Number Of The Beast” - back then at least a few Heavy Metal records were available even in small village’s electronic shops and standard supermarkets’ LP shelves. I’m under the spell of extreme music ever since. “At War With Satan” followed, “Show No Mercy”, the Metal Massacre compilations on Metal Blade Rec., everything dark and extreme. When you start with Hardrock as a baby then I guess you won’t end up as a Justin Timberlake fan. Still, my thirst for new music hasn’t been quenched with new Metal sub-genres alone, so I listened to all kinds of music since mid teenager years, from classical to 80s Rock and Noise or stuff like Joy Division and other guitar based music like My Bloody Valentine. Beside Kraftwerk and early Industrial I started listening to Electronic at the beginning of the 90s, while exploring the avant-garde of Jazz and classical/Neue Musik later.
I have been far away from any (Black) Metal between 2000 and 2006, pissed with the scene and the situation we - as a band - were in. But Black Metal is in my veins, here I am again. The break (from Metal) has been something I needed, Metal music and lifestyle accompanied my soul as an early child, as a teenager, as an early twen, through every phase of my life. Maybe the Metal free years have been the final step to detach myself from the last traces of the Peter Pan syndrome, who knows, I never thought about this aspect. I’m here, an adult person in an adult Black Metal scene, thanx to the people that pushed it out of it’s apathy - out of it’s childhood, like End All Life/Norma Evangelium Diaboli, Northern Heritage, the artists on those labels and some other individuals in the late 90s/early 00. Men that created an obvious alternative to the weak, tired and commercially trapped originators. I bow my head with honest respect to those who made this music extreme again.
And why my religious and world views correlate with the content of Black Metal, that’s another thing and hard to answer – I never consciously made a decision and my pact with Him has no date, at the age of about 12 my schoolbooks were full of upside down crosses and pentagrams, even at this early age not only for aesthetic/musical reasons. My fave reading back then has been the Professor Zamorra novel series, sympathising only with the demons. Everything in my childhood witnessed to my fascination for the darkside, not to speak of my twisted thoughts: I remember a bicycle ride home from the bus station, 11 years old, still have the image in my head, the gravel path, the front tyre... I thought I am different, I am “chosen” by Him. At the age of 5 I had a repetitive dream, every night, of a procession of men in robes, and while I had this dream I was sleep walking and awakened in my parent’s room. Satan In Me, always, forever.”

It has often struck me as strange that black metal is something that has spawned from the Western society, where most people have the possibilities to create a good life, having friends, get some fine education, a decent job, raising good kids and so on. Frankly speaking, I can’t really understand why so many people have the desire to perform and even listen to this devilish music. Why do more and more people listen to black metal? (Be aware that I do really like non-Western black metal as well, but the majority comes from such wealthy countries as Norway, Sweden, Finland, some of the richest and most modern societies in the world nowadays. Perhaps you can discuss black metal in regard to symptoms of the development, or lack of it, of society?)
“I guess when you battle for food or live in total oppression, you hardly do some relaxed walk out in the nightly forest, read inspiring books, grow up with Bathory and record demos on your fancy 4tracker - like all of us did back then. Such countries have their folklore and their shallow Pop that let the people dream of European wealth, but you won’t find any fine, developed art. If you would live somewhere in the desert, in the cavallas of Brazil, in a small drug cartel controlled mountain village in Colombia etc (without naming more global examples, you know what I mean) you surely wouldn’t play Black Metal. So your analysis is right, Black Metal is mostly created in rich countries. But I would neither consider it as decadent symptom of a bored wealthy society, nor as an anti-Christian revenge of people deprived of their culture and history, as some Pagan Metal guys like to see it.
Why more and more people listen to Black Metal – obvious, isn’t it, with the trendy bands that either adapt their art to the mass market, or try to sell themselves as Underground with some stylish black/white layout and semi-rough sound and slick slogans in interviews, while being the same lame and tame scum as their commercial comrades. A bit of money is involved now, labels buy out bands, musicians sell their souls (to the labels). Money is great, I would be happy if "Kénôse" or "VVorldVVithtouEnd" sells more than 50 000, but there are artists where you can hear they have the $ sign in their eyes right from the early production stage, and sadly those front the covers of the big magazines. People swallow it, or better, they have no other option than buying it because real Black Metal is something they have no (mental) access to and will forever stay alien to their ears and minds.”

People who have performed the fine art of black metal the last 15-20 years were often very young when they began. They were opponents… of something (often defined as Christianity). As they found their identity, the music and messages often became more personal and introvert. And many bands tried to capture various (dark) atmospheres. But, being an adversary can be easy, while arriving at a solution seems to be harder. So, tell me, is black metal only music of the challengers? After all, those who listen (by heart) to black metal are more often than not already in agreement with the views of the antagonists… (A solution is harder to find compared to be critical towards… society, religion, human kind, whatever)
“Definitely, absolutely, I agree 100%. While the lyrics are better to read due to better English and a more advanced poetic form, the contents hardly offers any solutions, not even questions most of the times. This is something that has to be both developed and demanded. There are artists that include something more in their lyrics than fantasy (“beneath the dragon’s wings me and my sword blah blah”), megalomania (“I am the frostbitten demon that strikes with the winterstorm blahblah”), hate or blasphemy. Lyrics that make you think about your concepts and - even as an outcome of your own thinking process, not served on a plate - you could find solutions to the questions you had in mind for a long time. Like music, lyrics should progress constantly in general. Still, well written personal visions and hateful outbursts of scorn will always be a part of Black Metal and stay an enjoyable read.
There are many ways to worship the devil - not only traditional and obvious ones. There’s people that search for wisdom and go back to i.e. Sumerian cults, follow Gnostic traditions, while I find Satan right here in every animated and unanimated being, on earth and beyond. For me Satan is
1. omnipotent and omnipresent
2. entity (in the traditional sense including all historic manifestations which help us to realize and understand) and also metaphor (but not in the Laveyan sense)
3. beyond the obvious life-/earth-/human- bound concepts of good and evil.
We use these concepts to position Abigor, but deeds and thoughts described as "evil" in the Christian world of values are not perceived as evil from my point of view. Having said that, I confirm that bands who leave the path of orthodox devil worship, witchcraft and magick most of the time do so because they are just uneducated and half-hearted and try to hide their ill-information, not because they offer anything else. Or with other words: "VVorldVVithoutEnd" is an album I prefer not only music- but also lyricwise over 99% of the "different" albums, although it doesn’t offer any "solutions", and yet it’s a close to perfect Black Metal album.
Furthermore, one that dedicates his life to music and uses his time for his composition is maybe not an advanced poet and definitely not a philosopher, doesn’t spend his day with reading or has talent for the written part of Black Metal, but the approach of the lyrical content of an album should still be one that differs from pure blasphemy.”

A lot of discussion about who started what has been going on for years. Venom’s “Black Metal” started the nametag perhaps, but it would be interesting to know what/who started the whole thing, seeing it from your point of view? After all, Venom’s music is far from what we consider to be Norwegian Black metal, which again is far from what we consider to be American Black metal, which again is far from what we consider to be French Black metal… and so on… (I don’t want this to be a discussion about Venom, it was just meant as a reference point to what many (most?) consider to be the origin of black metal)
“ “Welcome To Hell” and “Black Metal” never had the atmosphere of the 20 minute title track “At War With Satan”, which was so dense, simply perfect at the time, I never heard anything like that before. There have always been moments in music that just left you mesmerized, that created those dark images. You can’t break it down to a line of notes, a certain progression of chords – it’s something that’s out of reach, this kind of atmosphere in music laughs at any attempt to be analyzed. Intense dark, cold moments that reveal a tiny bit of infinity. The long instrumental parts of Iron Maiden’s debut had some moments like that, of course Slayer’s “Hell Awaits”, Celtic Frost’s “To Mega Therion” (more than their debuts “Show No Mercy” and “Morbid Tales” respectively) and many others, Infernal Majesty, Carnivore, Voivod ... Even Judas Priest, early Black Sabbath both had a few of those moments. There has always been a very sinister element in Metal, and not without reason did the PMRC start a war against the “devil music” Heavy Metal.
But no matter how exclusive and cool your references for your own music are (some try to get credibility by listing early 90s underground BM in interviews but have obviously only been influenced by Darkthrone and Burzum again), as soon as you listen to a band, your old heroes as well as all the other, even shitty, Black Metal bands of the respective time, you are heavily influenced. If you want it or not, it just happens. If something hits your ear, even if you try to do something completely different, you’re influenced. And this is a very complex process that can’t be judged in retrospective. So, who’s responsible for the Genesis of this genre? It was Metal’s own history, the feeling, the times, the tapetrading, the magazines, the air we breathed, it just happened, no one started Black Metal, we all started it (as Hippie-esque as this sounds). But I’d like to view Black Metal in a larger context, namely Satanic Art. And to discuss and analyze how far this tradition goes - outright, hinted or hidden alike - is worth another magazine alone. Satanic Art breeding in our collective subconscious...”

One thing that strikes me as rather odd, is the way those who play and listen to black metal behave in society. Arrogant while calm and controlled. Questioning, yet not political interested. And the metal concerts, as least in Norway, are relaxed and people are having a good time listen to some great music. Why are black metallers [mostly] calm people? Is black metal music a let-out-some-steam type of music that makes you relaxed? (The reason this is asked, is because I experience that metal concerts are the most comforting and great concerts in the world. I mean, go to a rap-concert, and you run the risk of getting shot any second…)
“I worked at a large music shop and have a recording studio so I’m informed about those outside Metal things as well: go to a 2step (name of some disgusting HipHop/Drum& Bass mixture) party in London and get shot if you’re at the wrong time in the wrong place. Go to a suburb Drum&Bass event in the mid 90s and step on somebody’s trainers, chances are you end up swallowing a glass bottle. But that’s the kind of violence of criminals who live in sub standard flats and go out to let off some steam. Like back in the 80s when the frustrated low working class district youth turned to Nazi skinheads (not because of political conviction but just for the action). That’s all violence for the “wrong” reason, if I may say so, although violence in any form supports one of the thoughts of Black Metal. It’s not that these people want to get rid of humanity, they’re just pissed with their own fucked up lives.
But I remember dangerous Thrash Metal concerts in the late 80s, where violence was in the air just for the sake of it. These were glorious concerts, you helped someone who fell down in the pit, and he smiled and put the fist right in your face. The music was violent so you went home bleeding most of the time. But anyway, do you believe Black Metal “fans” and the majority of Black Metal musicians are any "better" than the i.e. average Florida Deaths Metal guy (when it comes to the discrepancy between image and real life)? The answer is: no. Things are much better in the underground, but the serious individuals are surely outnumbered. Nevertheless, Black Metal is sacred and there’s many respectable people involved, just not enough that fill the big gap between Black Metal’s contents and the actual scene. And, although you put it in another relation in your question, being calm and controlled is the premise on the Satanist path. Like wolves among sheep we have wandered. With my everlasting deep respect for the concepts of Euronymous, these days wearing spikes and looking grim at the pub means nothing. Better beware of the smiling guy with the green shirt instead of the corpsepainted concert visitor, know what I mean?”

Some bands have decided not to perform their music to a hungry, or perhaps worn out, audience. The most wellknown example in the extreme metal scene is DarkThrone. Why have you chosen to avoid the cheering crowd who knows your songs, leaving your creation(s) to remain only as documented fact(s) of what you had in mind at the time of the release(s)?
“Darkthrone have played live, in their early days and even at least once in their glorious times.
You earn money (even not directly but through merchandise, and CD sales increase when you’re exposed to a large crowd) and you reach new people, and it may be a buzz to see 1000 hands hailing your music rhythmically. But it’s absolutely not for us. I’ve hardly ever seen a concert that has been the manifestation of the images that Black Metal evokes when you close your eyes and listen with headphones. Playing concerts is a waste of time in my eyes, you could compose an album and/or develop your music and concept in the same time. Also sculptors or painters don’t travel around the world to show what they have created the previous years… I go out to see an orchestra perform classical/Neue Musik every now and then though, unlike Metal it’s such an intense experience, you hardly dare to breathe.
But Metal concerts will always be an event of fun and therefore Black Metal live is not possible. Let me add still I respect bands that play an intense show, those that caused some havoc were Marduk, Mysticum, last year Antaeus impressed me, or some weeks ago Kawir celebrated the old school feeling… and I’m looking forward to hear Blacklodge presenting “SolarKult” live.”

A lot of the black metal culture has been about fighting against Christianity. I take it for granted that Christianity serves as a symbol for the society, which, at least in the Western Societies, is deeply rooted in the plague of the Church and Christendom. But, why use the energy on something people believe in, instead of fighting against something more real? And, why is anti-Christ a better solution than Christ? And finally, why spend so much energy (in your youth?) to spread the sentence that could be said with only a few words, namely that “we hate Christianty”? What is so bad with Christendom? (This is a natural topic in connection with black metal, since at least Nordic Black metal exploded when a few churches were burnt and a couple of guys were murdered)
“It’s not only the present Catholic community, it’s the values and the moral of Christianity that are opposed to my own belief - views on guilt, sin, Christ as the saviour, ... Yet it’s not THAT easy, because Christianity itself can be viewed and judged in many different ways, the Urkirche has not much to do with the medieval or today’s "church". First of all, we are living in Europe and are forced to deal with Christianity, as Christianity is forced upon most of the people since birth, is taught at school, and even is a criterion when you want to have certain jobs - it became more something like a tradition than a religion.
What you can easily figure and hate is the moral, “philosophy” (or the lack of any) and way of life of the average Sunday morning church visitor, but it’s what the average Metal musician told you already in the 80s, Christianity representing American and European society in general. Teenage rebellion. On the other hand the bible, or better the hidden content that you could excavate when you try to see through it’s layers of modifications and time based changes, can be an interesting book for a devil worshipper, like others stated prior to me. It depends on if you see the bible (separate view on old and new testament) as a book of law, a book of allegories and codes, or if you think it is a script that witnessed events. In every case you have to filter out the author. Often one just has to replace a single word to transform it’s meaning. Read the lyrics of Funeral Mist’s “Salvation” and you find much more than anti-Christian slogans.

You may have answered this already, but still I’d like to go into the aspect that hits the listener first – the sound (of music). There are [almost] as many different sounds as there are bands. However, there are two different strategies. One is the Underground way, which means a distinctive rather thin sound, where atmosphere seems more important than a levelled mastering or a perfect mixing. The other is the top notch sound, where everything is loud and clear and often claimed as being less atmospheric and more sterile. However, what I’m interested in, is the way you approach the sound you desire. Do we speak of numerous hours of testing, recording, mixing and mastering? Or, perhaps intuition rules your world and the rehearsal sound is the better? In other words, how do you develop the soundpicture to make it fit your vision? (It’s probably easy to be very technical here, and that’s all fine. At the same time it is interesting to read how you think about and approach your visions, until you have a final pleasing result)
“My daily “listening program” includes the most advanced mixdowns like Deathspell Omega, Mayhem etc down to the roughest sounds of SVEST, Moonblood or Mütiilation. But of course every style of music must be presented in the adequate clothes. While I could imagine a few bands with both sound options – rough or clean, think Watain, Ofermod, Kriegsmaschine f.e., most of the time the music determines the sound and only one distinctive sound fits. Our music demands a worked out, exact, detailed mixdown, as we incorporate a multitude of additional layers in our compositions, and they would be lost with a rehearsal sound. This happened in the 90s with some of our releases where the wrong decisions in the recording, mixdown and mastering stage led to a mash that swallowed both the power and the details. On the other hand, our second demo “Lux Devicta Est” is still dripping with atmosphere, the (mixdown-free/one cheap microphone) sound fitted perfectly.
I could easily go into technical details now, as I am audio engineer and we record in our own studio hell-lab@hotmail.com, but that’s not what you’re interested in I guess. What is still important: as clean and polished the sound can be, a fucking Pop mastering never fits Black Metal. (mastering is the last stage of working on the material before the pressing plant. After the multiple-track mixdown, you send the stereofile or tape to the mastering house and this is nearly as important as the mixdown, but a completely different step on the way of creating an album. Good mastering is vital - even if you create an extremely rough recording, you want that exactly the sound you hear is maintained and not fucked up in the various stages. Although it sounds paradox, quality mastering even on a rehearsal style recording would make sense theoretically)
Louder = better is exclusively true for fucking radio music. When you push the level at mixdown and mastering you have to sacrifice something, it’s simple physics and no one can surmount this fact. I.e. the snare, kick or toms won’t come through in a piercing way like they should, or you can’t have a loud dynamic bass in such a to-the-wall mastering, and the rhythm guitars (due to their frequencies) will be brought to the very front and swallow everything else. Still I noticed many Black Metal/Extreme Metal musicians fall into this trap and ruin their work, or the (mastering) engineer that is used to his Pop/commercial music techniques. I passionately hate this, and basically it’s a by-product of the CD format.”

There are many roads to hell. There are many words to describe these paths. To many listeners your choice of words do not mean anything, others are interpreting, reflecting and even having discussions about your lyrics and the topics you’ve chosen to write about. And then there’s the combination between the music and the lyrics. Could you briefly tell us about your inspirations and how these make you write the music you play? And on the same topic, when somebody admits that they’re inspired by your music (be it musically, lyrically or in life in general), is this something that influence you? (the reason I ask about this is that when you were a little baby, you were dependent on feedback, caring and interaction with others. Somehow I tend to think that we still feed from interaction with others in one or many other different ways. Like, if nobody said anything at all about your music, do you think you would be able to make more music?)
“Definitely not. Disrespect and ignorance can of course fuel the hatred, and hatred is licked by the flame called creativity. Still I am grateful when someone understands and values our music. But there are other inspirations and influences. I think great pieces of art have a background of various feelings - hate, pain, fear, psychotic episodes. A 16 year old boy who didn’t experience anything would most probably come up with a tame work, although a great deal of vision, fantasy and imagination could balance out lack of experience of life. Simply, who hasn’t suffered can hardly come up with inspired works.
I find it very hard to analyze what influenced our albums. Musical influences, as stated above, come from every note you hear in your life, if you want it or not. Reading, studying and thinking about certain topics creates visions, and as musician you should be able to transform these visions into music - and ideally lyrics as well. A reading list could also give you a clue, but inspirations can’t be broken down to this and that. Everything influences your art, really everything. One that tells you he’s inspired by a nightly walk out in the forest is most probably just as much influenced by his disgust for (or fear of) big cities, but it doesn’t sound as cool of course, so you’ll probably only read about often mentioned influences (i.e. books, nature) and not the daily life of someone.
For example this interview influences my work simply because I think about things, and these thoughts result in sharper concepts and visions.”

There’s been some time since Abigor’s former full-length release was spawned upon us. And in my opinion this time has done the band good, since it was bordering on the path of repetition if one shall judge a couple of releases. At the same time, in preparation for this ‘view, I must admit that a couple of releases were better than I remembered. Instead of going on an on about each release, could you rather travel a bit back in time and tell us what led you to your break (if we can use such a word)?
“First of all, I don´t think we have walked anywhere near the border of repetition with the music – and our last album, “Channelling The Quintessence Of Sata”n (I quit after this, PK did “Satanized”), is in my eyes one of our best works, music and concept-wise. Still the sound and vocals didn´t live up to the compositions, the latter not in the case that they weren´t good, but Abigor always needed to be fronted by a highly individual and expressive voice, such as Silenius in the 90’s and now even more with AR. This album (“CTQOS”) will surface in a different form one day or another…
But you are totally right bringing in the word repetition when it comes to other things, and this, in a retrospective view, has surely been the most important reason for my retreat – and if I dare to guess also PK´s reason to care for other projects in 2003... …everything became routine. Same way of doing music/rehearsing, same label, same studio – a path to stagnation, because with our label (Napalm), studio (Hörnix) and workflow (how we composed/rehearsed) progress wasn’t possible in the long run for various reasons..
And also the “scene”, a once mighty movement, shallowed at the turn of the millennium and had nothing to offer so one could be an enthusiastic contributor. Actually this was just the calm before the storm, a new movement that represented a new seriousness was in the making, with the spearhead being End All Life/Norma Evangelium Diaboli but also Northern Heritage, Ajna and some individuals with a vision.”

Abigor got in touch with End All Life. And C. signed the band for the upcoming “Fractal Possession”. However, and before we dive into the album, there are a couple of other elements that need to be questioned. Like, since you’ve been a part of the black metal scene from the first half of the 90’s, what do you think of the development of the scene? And you can safely highlight NoEvDia as a label here, because it has turned into my personal favourite…
“What do you mean with “first half of the 90s”? (I meant the band Abigor – Roy) I had the “At War With Satan” cover (the gatefold with the burning inverted cross inside) taped to my children’s room wall, so to say I have been there since the very beginning is an understatement!
Development of the scene? 50% of my motivation to participate in public Black Metal (and what else is it? We’re not recording rehearsal demos. Releasing records and giving interviews has nothing to do with living a certain way and/or creating art, it is the decision to interact, hence being a part of the scene) is the urge to do so with Abigor, and 50% is exactly this development of the scene in the last couple of years, or better, exactly since I left (in 1999/2000). I kept my head down and studied audio engineering, built a studio, listened to other music like obscure guitar based stuff, electronic, Neue Musik/avantgarde etc, and as I realized what happened in the meantime it was a refreshing shock! You ask me about End All Life/Norma Evangelium Diaboli? I am the biggest devotee you can think of, the history and label profile is unchallanged, and just think of the latest releases as the most relevant creations this music has to offer: Deathspell Omega, Katharsis, Antaeus, Blacklodge, Diapsiquir, Mütiilation, Funeral Mist, should I go on with the catalogue? I discovered their records and as I had two or max. three I felt something special, magic, more than a logo on the back of the cover. I immediately ordered everything I could get without listening as I was convinced something released on these labels (EAL/NED) must have a certain quality. The labels and the force behind it shaped not only “Fractal Possession” to a certain extent, but I am convinced about also the scene as a whole when I look at various records these days, how they are presented etc.
I am really enthusiastic how things are recently, there are new labels that seem to have something else in mind than making business: Flamme Noire, Kyrck, Black Hate, Todeskult and many more.
I think the development has been essential, we all grew up, and you shouldn’t forget Black Metal as we know it was shaped by teenagers. With 30+ and as individuals who create satanic art, there is no more room for trolls and dragons, sheetmetal swords, airbrush covers and what not. Satanic art must disturb and irritate people and not please them with nice riffs and empty phrases. And I am glad that there is an army of new people that have the same vision. I have the deepest respect to those individuals!”

THEOLOGY

Do you in any way think that by using black metal as a means to release souls from their daily trivialities, you will be able to reach such an aim? Like in, is black metal an aim in itself or is it an aim for something outside you? After all, most of those who listen to black metal normally stay put on the left hand path…
“You can’t use Black Metal as a vehicle “to release souls from daily trivialities”, that’s the old romantic idea of coming home, taking the headphones on, close your eyes and escape to the fantasy world. A record should for sure ask for all your attention, the music, the lyrics, the lay-out, but I can’t see a strict line between every day life and Black Metal - Black Metal should primarily be art and as such the manifestation of something spiritual. It can be a religious act, expression, self realization, an attack on something etc. It must not be a fairytale, or Heavy Metal with screaming voices and a roleplay with some nice symbols on top. I even would say that simple nihilism is also an offence to such inspired lyrical works like “Salvation” or “Si Monumentum Requires, Circumspice”… Pure blasphemy is not enough for an artform with a more than 15 years old history…
In this regard, yes, Black Metal could be a push to people but I am convinced that individuals that choose the left hand path do so because they are born this way, not because of Black Metal – what about all people before 1991, and even before Heavy Metal or Rock?”

Let us not leave the black metal theology yet, as I wonder why you really make Abigor breathe still. Peter said in 1996 “With our art we want to realize ourselves, and to spread words of Satan”. Why do you believe so much in the art of Abigor, that you continue to use it as your megaphone? If you really want to change anything, to make people think and to affect the society, why not enter the political world?
“As soon as you can think for yourself you have the desire to “change anything”, but that neither means you’re an artist nor a politician. You can easily play a few chords or put some colour on a canvas but again, that doesn’t mean you’re an artist. You can sit in the parliament and be on the country’s pay-roll but that doesn’t mean you want to change anything. And you can put an upside-down cross on your cover and spread anti-Christian phrases but that doesn’t mean you are anything worth in His eyes. There’s a thin line between all of this…
What else legitimates you to play Black Metal than spreading the words of Satan, a path if walked with awareness leads to self realization anyway…”
the forces of hell

I have got just one little excerpt of the lyrical patterns, and it is too little to judge by, or even to raise questions concerning Abigor’s biomechanical antichrist. Can you brief us on what we can expect this time? There are strange titles such as “3D Blasphemy”, “Cold Void Choir” and “Liberty Rises A Diagonal Flame”…
“As we joined forces again PK had written lyrics and music over the past years, while I started to write the music as we had the album in mind. That meant composing and recording from morning to evening, so this time not a single lyric comes from my side. And because of PK has written them over a longer period, and AR also contributed some, the topics differ from track to track. The summary that you now want from me will be printed on the sleeves/in the booklet, excerpts that represent the essence of each lyric.
I mean, I could maybe brief you that “The Fire Syndrome” and “Heaven Unveiled” deal with ritualistic suicide and more, “Injection Satan” summons the forces of hell, “Liberty Rises A Diagonal Flame” crushes your moral concepts of good and evil and leaves you out in the cold etc. These are my thoughts if I have a random guess, but as I said I haven’t written them and by writing down a “table of contents” I wouldn’t do the lyrics justice. And again, we agree to be satanic Black Metal, to be the devil’s messengers, and sometimes we discuss a lyrical concept for an album, but still I could be wrong interpreting a lyric written by PK or AR.
What I can reveal for the future is: we will explore the battle of demons and angels for the human soul, how this affects our earthly existence, on the next album. Very interesting, as those entities influence our life to a great extent.”

EXPANDING THE MUSICAL MIND

The way of playing has, judging from what I am able to differentiate, altered from a floating approach to today’s more direct and riffy structures. The tones are clearer and easier to distinguish, and somehow I think the music is parted into sections that are sewn [very well] together. Correct or not, how have you developed as musicians the last five to ten years?
“As musicians you develop, but real development is not of a technical nature. It happens when you expand your mind somehow and break boundaries, channel various influences of any kind. It won’t happen when you try to play like Malmsteen and listen to “Transylvanian Hunger” day in day out.
I think the best thing that happened was that I turned my back on the Black Metal scene and went my way for a time. Both electronic music and Neue Musik had a big influence on me. Electronic because it teaches you to pay attention to every single sound, and to surpass usual recording and production techniques - this is not a cold, theoretic approach that means a straight path to realize your musical visions, without being trapped in the cage of the usual guitar/drums recording process. Neue Musik shows you how small your tonal and dynamic field is. And it reminded me that true satanic art has to shock and disturb people, not only please them with nice melodies.”

I feel that you’re more focused and every turn and every beat has a purpose. I am not sure, since I haven’t been able to read the lyrics yet. And this concerns the writing process. Do you envision the music before you actually write and structure it? Like in, how do you incorporate your visions and inspirations with the result that you create songs you think I as a listener would like to relate to?
“It is an absolutely un-conceptual way of creating music. I can imagine for the next album, which will have a strict lyrical concept down to each song, that maybe asks for a continuous slow track, or one with a special instrumentation. Then you have to consider this when making the arrangements, but the actual riff-writing will still be a complete uncoupled process. This way you’re not forcing anything in a direction but can be totally inspired by the act of creating tones and just let it flow, a spiritual process which benefits from the fact that each of us makes music on his own, not in eye contact at some rehearsal.
Still, which lyrics are combined with what track is an obvious thing later, and there’s no choice… just like, a lyric like “The Fire Syndrome” asks for exactly the song it’s combined with, and also the other lyrics and songs on “Fractal Possession”, you can’t take one lyric and apply it to a different track. In the end, everything comes together naturally, with AR of course editing and re-writing parts of the lyrics to fit into the musical pattern.”

The production on “Fractal Possession” is very clear and it gives each instrument time to talk to the listener (me). In black metal I often think that the bass tend to drown in the wall of sound, and sometimes patience is not as rewarding as one might like to think. However, in the case of your new album there are some moments that make me freeze on my back. After 1.57 minutes into the “Lair Of Infinite Desperation” there’s such a bassy section I really look forward to every single time. Perhaps a bit narrow, but is such a following part written for the musical purpose solely, or is there a whole to it?
“That the bass has a more important role in the sound of Abigor is one of those things I learned while engineering all kinds of music (although you could say we started to realize it had no sense to try to fill the bass spectrum with the guitars in the late 90’s as well, I think PK introduced a bass on “Satanized” again, maybe we even had one on “CTQOS” – I listen to the studio outtakes of that album only which are guitars and drums in its original form). The bass has a frequency that simply can’t be done by the guitars and is essential to the sound as a whole.
In the mid-90’s (we included a bass in the early 90’s) we thought that our guitars are way enough to fill the soundfield, but we were wrong. Now that we use this instrument again the difficult thing is that it shouldn’t bring in too many new melodylines but still be original. We write the tracks without the bass in mind, and therefore the guitars alone fill the whole spectrum of (dis-)harmonies. In Abigor we always have at least 2 equally strong guitarlines (with a few guitars coming in and out where they are needed, a total freedom that our concept of denying to play live implies, even more now with our new way of writing music than ever before), and therefore the bass must not support one guitar, otherwise the balance between the 2 is lost. So, it has to be a new melody but still one that subordinates to the guitars.
Back to your question about certain melodies, “for musical purpose solely” is an understatement, what higher sense can something have in a track than for the musical purpose? Our music itself has a purpose and it’s not to write any nice track, it is extreme satanic art, a storm of emotions and thoughts (that unconsciously manifested in the melodies and harmonies). Writing music (with everything that is included, arranging, etc) is a spiritual act and you don’t have to think about any purpose or concept all the time. Development, thoughts, concepts, everything conscious is the preliminary work of doing an album. The actual process of composing music should be one that is like a mad fever dream.”

When you write your music, is every new riff meant to be better than the former? Like, every new creation is a new nirvana, if you see what I mean… Let me challenge you on the same subject: how do you know when a riff is as good as it gets?
“First of all, of course you change the inner structure of a riff as long as it seems great to you. But of course if it’s THE riff that furiously jumps out of the boxes and throws you into the pits of hell, you only hear that when the track is done with full instrumentation. Like, sometimes there’re 2 chords, a simple thing but they have something to them you can’t describe. Later in the process there is a sick melody added and the drums and maybe anything else, 3 voice guitar harmony… so, there’s often a part that is not THE one riff, but how it progresses, this could lead anywhere.
What is a good riff? For example, PK came to our old rehearsal room with the intro riff of “Kingdom Of Darkness”, a simple E chord with 2 chords following. After all these years (it’s the third song we’ve ever written as Abigor) I still get goosebumps when I hear the beginning of “Kingdom Of Darkness”.
A good riff is one that transports feelings. The most complex or simple one, fast or slow, there’s no limit. But of course you think each and every riff is good, otherwise you wouldn’t even record a demo of it.”

FRACTAL POSSESSION

Progressive black metal may not taste too well in the ears of a fan of this genre. But to me the music on “Fractal Possession” consists of numerous interesting fractions. Allow me to be funny and say that these various portions possess me in the sense that once I notice something, I really look forward to it the next spin. Are you afraid that you alienate the listener since your songs do not have the comfortable formula we know from (too) many bands? How would you like, if you could choose, the listener to ‘attack’ “Fractal Possession”?
“It’s a great description and absolutely correct that you noticed the music possesses you. And an essential question for sure: Progressive Black Metal… what is this? People that always ask for “Transylvanian Hunger” (I use this a second time here, an obvious example and a classic of course) style only these days are the same that listened to the blackened Rock’n’Roll of Venom in the early 90s and denied Burzum or Mayhem for being too whatever weird or so, and as for the harmonic structure some riffs on “De Mysteriis Dom Sathanas” or “Det Som Engang Var” are absolutely “progressive”. And people that think a copycat riff of “Trasylvanian Hunger” with 4 track production is “ugly” or evil or rough, but actually the melodies are as nice and ear friendly as it can get, are musical cowards.
Don’t get me wrong, I have absolutely no preferences, I listen to Moonblood as well as the most advanced well produced Black Metal, I enjoy both the same. But Black Metal MUST challenge the listener. It may take you into a calm state, let your imaginations flow on a melodic or ambient part, but it has to pierce your soul as well. I would go that far and say Katharsis’ masterpiece “VVorldVVithoutEnd” is progressive in the way that it presents a way of riffing that’s absolutely original (and in the same way the first Black Metal album that really reminded me on old German masters like early Destruction, not because of copied riffing but due to a certain, not definable feeling), or Mütiilation, the riffing sometimes reminds me of old Voivod and is it absolutely not common simple nice BM riffing, but yes, sometimes “progressive”.
What I want to say is, give me classic Black Metal riffing (like “Transylvanian Hunger”) everytime, great, but if anyone thinks this is ultimately “evil” or ugly, then the person has no clue what he is talking about. There are riffs on “Fractal Possession” that will make people paranoid for sure. On the other hand, yes, there’re parts that are very melodic and “ear friendly”/harmonic, but we just have to include both. As I told you writing music is an intuitive and natural process, we don’t control how an inspiration is channelled and manifested in our riffs. This is one of the reasons why our music is spiritual and a step on the path to the Lord.”

Most normally I try to listen to music without trying to understand everything. Or perhaps I try to consciously come up with my own interpretation. However, in the case of “Injecting Satan” I must ask you to please explain why the song fades after 2.51 minutes only to return with full force 7 seconds later? Because, if there’s no real meaning behind it except that you just want to fuck up my head, then this could’ve been better off…
“It doesn’t fade, it’s a low pass filtersweep that cuts out the high frequencies. I think it’s perfect that it sinks down to the centre of the earth and returns with a crash and a devilish scream. So far the people that heard it experienced it the same way, but for sure if you try to fiend a meaning it won’t please you.”

Despite the progressive approach in this album, the music still floats very well. I’m impressed with the way loads of surprising turns in the songs feel most natural. In my personal favourite “Cold Void Choir”, the music is rapid around 2 minutes. Then after 2.27 it slows a bit down onto to turn completely after 2.32. However, nothing feels out of place. How many times did you have to rehearse this to make it feel natural? The main question though deals with totality. How to you write in order to make the music float? What’s your main focus when you try to make the music float?
“It is easy. When a riff feels out of place you just keep it for another part. You feel it immediately when something absolutely doesn’t fit together. On the other hand, after the first stage of composition is done (the writing of the basic riffs), you can still build a bridge with additional guitars. But again: it is an analysis and a guess, because when you sit there with headphones on and playing/recording guitar, you are not doing math, it is a different state of mind – no matter how earthbound the technical side of the process is, setting a loop on the computer, recording, editing… but as soon as the tones are flowing, you thoughts are decoupled in a way – otherwise you’re not writing music but do handcrafts. It’s hard to imagine, but really the most technical aspect can become magic…”

The vocals are many, though still perhaps only one vocalist. In the aforementioned “Cold Void Choir” the (Mayhem’s) Atilla-feel is present after 3.33 minutes, hanging in there for the rest of the track. Now tell me, how did you end up with such a diverse vocal expression, having the former career in mind where the vocals are way more one-dimensional, at least in comparison…
“I am totally convinced that the vocals are just perfect for Abigor, or better, the new incarnation of the demon. Attila is of course one of the most original Black Metal vocalists, but still I think the vocals of AR are more diverse, varied, evil (because he lives and breathes every single word he sings right in the moment of the recording until he spits blood, he has been quite obnoxious in the hours before and after the recording, hehehe), and also hits the notes perfectly in the tonal parts. And the articulation is unchallenged, he celebrates every syllable.
And: his basic voice has no effect, no reverb/room, nothing, it’s absolutely effect free (of course with EQ, compression etc. but nothing that alters the voice). I have put some reverb on a few melodic parts, or added a delay on this word or another, but his actual voice throughout the tracks is pure. He did various performances on each song, we had about 3-5 vocal tracks per song. This gave us enough “material” to do all the worked out double vocals on some parts or stereo effects which are actually just vocals from another track (“track” - not another song, another version/take of the same song).
But with all detail, edits, attention and clinical execution of the actual production, the album is basically very direct and “true”. No effect on the basic voice, no triggered drums, no reverb on the guitars, everything is very direct. This is the advantage of engineering experience, high quality studio gear and the unlimited studio time, you can work out the tiniest detail but still don’t have to prettify something. If the performance and recording is great, you can go from there.
Silenius perfectly fitted to our old albums, he had a highly individual voice, the powerful screaming of “Verwüstung” is great, the variation and otherworldly performance of “Apokalypse”, he was a master on his territory. But now we reached a new era, and here the vocals of AR make an all important part of the “new” Abigor.”

You will in short time begin to receive reviews and diverse expressed response. What do you expect from the reviews this time, thinking that this new expression is far from the Abigor most of us have learnt to like?
“Of course, as every artist, I want the reviews to be enthusiastic or totally negative. I have no problem with a 1 out of 6 critic. The worst thing would be if one can’t find the access to the music and doesn’t know how to handle it, but because of the advanced technical aspect feels compelled to write a good critic. If someone doesn’t appreciate satanic art without limits, then he should at least respect us for our artistic achievement, but for hell’s sake be honest enough and write that the music just leaves him speechless and untouched, not any “they can play their instruments and the songs are all demanding, but somehow blah blah blah”, he should write it’s musical scum to his ears.

How many times do you think the listener needs to really digest “Fractal Possession”? The reason this is being asked is due to the all the details in the music. The music [almost] never rests and it demands a lot from the inexperienced as well as the experienced listener.
"One thing: we DON’T judge ourselves to be progressive, technical or whatever, we play how we feel and how we can. We never, not a single time, did a single note to do something “technical/progressive”, this is utterly disgusting! Our music flows out of our souls just as naturally as the simplest riff on “Panzerfaust” (not to overuse the “TH” example, hehehe). Of course it is demanding to play it, and often I sit here and struggle to get a too complicated riff clean on tape, but it is how we hear the music in our minds, we just transform what is inside us. Most of the time I hear a riff in my head before I play it, and when this is one that’s tricky to play, what the fuck should I do, water it down to please anybody, listener, critic, anyone? We have the techniques now to realize our musical visions, and we use it, everything else would be fake, would be pleasing a market, and betraying ourselves.
And as a logical consequence to my words, our music is highly accessible anyway, every note is there for a reason, to transport an emotion, nothing is artificially constructed – and such music can only be accessible and hit one’s soul if similar feelings are there to be evoked.”

I’m afraid that the music demands a lot from the sound on stage, but in my opinion the music on “Fractal Possession” definitely deserves an audience due to the many great and cool parts in your music. I am certain few will be bored while watching and hearing you in a venue nearby. Inform us about what we can expect when we eventually get to listen to Abigor live on stage…
“No Abigor live. First of all, we need to have 100% (not 99%) freedom when we compose our music. If we want 6 guitars and a backward drum, we just do it without a thought. So many times did I hear “but we can’t do this live then” from other bands recording in the studio, when I suggested some additional instrument. This is self – restriction. So, live would be possible if you come with minimum 10 musicians and a truck of technique.. And the character of our music isn’t determined by the harmonies/melodies and lyrics/concept only, also the sound and execution is more important than ever before.
The second reason is that only a very specific style of Black Metal works live. I have seen Antaeus live and they were like a storm, as they played the last track (one of their new album) I just stood there in the middle of a sonic hurricane. Or a different style, Kawir, it reminded me on a feeling between “Live In Leipzig” and “Scorn Defeat”. Very raw Black Metal. For everything else, and definitely the form of Black Metal that we present, I would like to see expensive stage design, sophisticated lighting, projections and what not. With people sitting and shut up (this is what another musician once proposed as well). Here we entered the third reason, the atmosphere that hardly lives up to the serious matter of the lyrics and the concept of satanic art. Nothing against having fun and drinking a beer, but Black Metal is sacred, a Black Metal concert should be an act of worshipping the devil, from all participants – have you ever seen one that was such a pure act?”
When I saw Watain in Oslo with ca. 100 spectators, that was probably the closest!

SATAN

Not all melodies on the new album is what I’d consider dark, which goes well hand in hand with the thought that without light there would be no darkness. Do you in some wicked way consider dark music such as black metal as a symptom of the ignorance in our Western societies and the way most people relate to easy-listening music like popular music from the MTV-top 20 and such? Do you perhaps think that in a balanced civilization there would be no need for Satan and his rebel songs?
“We have to divide Satanism and Black Metal here on this specific question. As for the music, I don’t know how the effects would be if we would lead an absolutely balanced life, one that completely represents the ideal of our individual imagination, self realization in pure form. A paradox surely (total freedom of the individual is not possible for many reasons – not only practical, but you assume that humans are striving for peace and harmony - do they really?). Also if you would be the dictator of whatever country, have an unlimited bank account, you are still influenced by the world surrounding you, except you live in isolation which influences you in a different way.
Definitely, your social contacts, the society, every day life, your surrounding, simply the world you’re living in influences your art to a great extent. And this is not a bad thing for sure. Art must react on the current state of whatever field it is bound to play in (Black Metal must also react on Black Metal, not in an obvious way, but still).
Still, it must not be reactionary art in the sense of the word of course. And to strip spiritual art down as a reaction to its surrounding is of course nonsense. So, an artist is shaped by “the world” a lot for sure, but to what extent and an assumption how utopia would influence this is a far too hypothetical thought to follow.”

But there’s one really important thing I as a non-believer in any Satan, God, Allah, Lucifer, Jesus, etc etc, wonder about, how is so that so many people choose to believe in something outside oneself? You use Satan yourself, probably as a metaphor, but who is your God eventually?
“Without any limits and metaphors, I believe in Satan being an entity as well as being the seminal substance (in a non-physical sense) present in every cell, everything in and surrounding us. This is where our affinity with themes describing aspects of the universe in older lyrics comes from – just imagine the infinite universe, a manifestation and a proof of the omnipresence of Satan (AR said, as he listened to the new mastered version of “Fractal Possession”, that even if the lyrics don’t include themes around the horns that lurk beyond the stars, still this aspect is present in the music alone. The music spins you right into the middle of nothingness, the centre of the universe, the blackest antipole – to the paradoxes of micro- and macrocosm… passing the stars and all possible worlds, you float somewhere in the void witnessing His presence. This is right in our music, at least in some parts, without the lyrics underlining it).
I have no strict belief following any (single) written and published form of Satanism (at least not what you describe as average book about Satanism, to be found in the local esoteric shop), I belief that many conditions, historical situations, incarnations, manifestations, all different forms point to the one single revelation. So much for my own belief.
AR has written some lyrics that break up the absolute duality of good and evil, although being unquestionably of a Satanic nature. At first I wasn’t sure if this integrates perfectly into the concept of Abigor, but it does. In the end, what is being described as “evil” is based on a Christian concept of morality, but we surpassed this concept for sure. Yet it is legitimate to use this conception of good and evil to position ourselves in the world of these traditional values and terms. But if one thinks and acts “evil” and by himself judges his deeds and thoughts as “evil”, it seems utterly wrong to me. What is called “evil” must seem good and right to you, to your own perception, otherwise you are just a product of Christian morality.”

DETAILS

Why should we listen to “Fractal Possession” in headphones?
“Because you will discover things that would be hidden to you otherwise. And it is a good way to focus on the album. Of course with good monitors you hear everything just as good, but with headphones you cut your connection to the outside world even more. When I listen to Black Metal, I take the cover, insertsheet, whatever, and even if the lyrics aren’t printed I look at the artwork right through the last note of the album. This is a mostly forgotten way of listening to music, but it is a highly rewarding one. Great art deserves our full attention, the experience is a really different one if you focus all your senses on it. This is of course just as valid for our multi-layered music as well as primitive, raw, simple art, no matter how it is presented.”

Much of “Fractal Possession” is fast forward in the speed of light. Do you think that this yin to the slower yang is a necessity to make extreme music interesting? The reason I ask is that I sense your thoughtfulness behind the creativity of this excellent album is ever-present, and that few or no changes are done without purpose. Let me give an example. In “Vaporized Tears” the first three minutes are pretty fast, but the great turn after 3.12 minutes feels more brutal in all its melodic approach compared to the fast parts that are basically fast rather than anything else. The melody, which sticks to my mind, is way more rememberable compared to if the track had been midpaced all the time… Let me also add that the development of the track is really great!
“With my words about the spiritual, intuitive process of creating those tones in mind, of course not a single note or beat is done without purpose in the end. Today’s technology gives us possibilities i.e. in the field of post-production, you can always go back and change a few things, re-arrange, whatever. For instance there has been a first version mastering and we did another one, a month after the mixdown was completed, still we changed some minor things, just in “Vapourized Tears” that you speak of now (you will maybe notice the added reverse sound at the beginning, the additional guitars in one part and the missing repetition of a whole part in the new version).
Concerning our “thoughtfullness”: the riffs alone determine the drumming (and it’s the drum rhythm that makes something fast or slow, even if it’s the same beats per minute). We write guitar only demos first, and the drums are added later. And while we do work on the arrangement, the editing and minor effects, treat it in every possible way you could think of, still it’s the riff that determines everything. This is the way we do our albums, step by step, and the first step is the riff, the riffs one after another. It’s the basic cell that determines everything that comes in later, every reverse effect, every drum beat, everything is actually in the riff as I see it. In example PK gives me a riff, and I add 5 guitars and effects and a lightningfast beat and edits to it, and still, the order of how the single notes are put together and how they are played, read: the (his) riff, is the DNA of the most advanced symphony I could construct. So, you could spin this thought and say no matter how many layers of sound, how many tracks of additional guitars and drums and whatnot is added, it’s all in the few notes that form the basic riff. And one more thing: I have absolutely no respect for people that add one shitty melody over another, some “symphonic” Black Metal that consists of 50 tracks of cheesy layers found in Gothic keyboard music. Every layer ultimately must have a purpose and not fill in what’s missing.
And to your very first question (in this paragraph of question, hehehe): no, I don’t think songs or parts of an album have to contrast with each other. A fast album without a pause, or a throughout slow one can be as interesting as one that includes various tempi and moods. Maybe it is harder, it surely is, to do something interesting just in one style (because of human physics: the ear and section of the brain that’s responsible for hearing perceives things relative to something. When a sound is loud all the way, there’s a natural mechanism that lowers your perception. That’s why you perceive a dynamic record in the long run as louder than one that is on the limit all the time. Same with something fast, you won’t get a rush of aggression of a fast beat after 5 fast songs if you don’t hear a slower beat, only then you can experience a furious outrage again). We don’t do our tempi on a conscious level, it just happens. And again, my personal taste is that a fast, a slow or a varied album all can be great.”

FINALE

Finally, and I think it’s time for the regular closer. Do you think that Abigor in cooperation with End All Life will release one of the top-5 albums in 2007? As in, why should people invest money and time in “Fractal Possession”? And if you have some ending words, please write them in another interview…
“Last question, so these are my ending words anyway, otherwise I couldn’t answer this question at all, hehehe… but good that you block the usual rockstar “thanx to our fans, thanx for buying our album, see you on tour” bullshit…
Ok, why should people invest money in “Fractal Possession” – if we wouldn’t believe it to be something precious also for someone else than ourselves, we would have kept in on our computer, not spreading it as good as possible. So I am totally convinced this is one of the albums that shape 2007, and it is here to stay, a manifest of mature, unrestricted and absolute, hence satanic, art.”